cat education

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Anna
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Re: cat education

Postby Anna » 06 Jun 2013, 12:17

Hi Mar.

It sounds stress-related to me - especially also considering how you've been trying to discipline the cat. As I mentioned in a previous post, it is important to cats to cover up their poo and therefore it does not sound instinctual for her to poo in the bidet. Cool to hear though that you've got three litter boxes and that they're clean. Then at least we know that that's not the problem.

Another option that is possible is that the cat now has her smell on the bidet and as such it has become a habit to poo there. For that one can clean the area extra well sometimes using special soap for this kind of problem that you can get at the pet store.

Otherwise I suggest calling a vet and asking them if you're able to and then try the Feliway that I suggested because it is the best solution I've found if the behavior is indeed stress-related.

I also suggest changing your starting-point from wanting the cat to accommodate to your needs and wants to realizing that when you are able to accommodate the cat's living requirements, it will also be able to live and co-exist with you in a way that is best for you too. That's the responsibility of humans when we have pets. Because see, even if the cat did do it because of some urge, it still doesn't justify abusing the cat to try and teach it a lesson.

With all issues that has come up with our cats, the solution has been to every time look at our environment and practically rearrange that in a way that is best for all. So it could be covering up the bidet or having that door closed at all times for example, until she changes her habit and start using the litterbox.

Thanks for sharing - many people face issues such as these so it is cool we can discuss it here.

Let us know how it goes.



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mar
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Re: cat education

Postby mar » 06 Jun 2013, 13:37

Now that i think about it, both the two cats sometimes cover their evacuation and sometimes not.... i'm wondering about the reason...

If it is a stress related pattern it's difficult to understand which is the cause. I'll try to pay more attention on her.

I'll try to take more care about her and if things don't change i'll go with Feliway.

Thankyou everybody for the support !



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KellyPosey
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Re: cat education

Postby KellyPosey » 13 Jun 2013, 01:54

The cat may also just like to poo there sometimes. We often do things because we like it/prefer it for some reason. So in such a case, you assess if it's a problem actually or not, then if it is, take the most gentle means of preventing it, like if there is a bathroom door maybe you can keep it closed. Unfortunately though there may not always be a perfect solution due to environment/situation factors. Don't know enough about what not covering their evacuation entails, depends on what all factors are involved there.

With cats unfortunately you can't just talk to them and reason with them and if there's something they are able to do and they like doing it they're not necessarily going to understand why they apparently can't/shouldn't do it, so we can't blame them for not understanding or for having preferences, what we can do is be the benevolent being who directs the situation as gently as possible. It's like when we blame a sidewalk when we trip over it, as if it could have moved out of the way or something, when we know the sidewalk isn't capable of moving. Or it's like telling a river to move, it won't work, all you can do is carefully redirect the flow. The cat really isn't in a position to know what's a problem, or be told what's a problem or what they can/can't do, and when it comes to pooping, it's a weird situation because typically animals would poo in nature where there are processes that break the poo down and you don't need to remove it manually (I mean because they didn't have hands to do so, anyway) it was how nature designed it but then we wanted to have animals live indoors with us so now they have to poo in a box that we have to manually empty, I mean who knows if that is comfortable for them, but overall they have done pretty well with it. The cat has been pretty savvy about it actually, I don't know any other animal that has had to deal with pooing in a box. Maybe the cat is trying to follow the cue of the human who uses such apparatus as the bidet in the pooing process themselves. At any rate, the cat's not in a position to take responsibility like the human can, so as the more able being it's our responsibility to be the caretakers of all creatures and give all the best life possible, as that's what we'd want done for us if the situation was reversed.



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Anna
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Re: cat education

Postby Anna » 13 Jun 2013, 08:38

That's a very cool perspective Kelly. We're the ones who has taken cats out of their natural environment - therefore we also have a responsibility to then establish an environment where they can thrive within the conditions we're presenting them with.



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barbara
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Re: cat education

Postby barbara » 14 Jun 2013, 00:33

Fascinating discussion here, all!
Currently we have only one cat - the other four have successively died over the last 3/4 or so years, and since moving into a flat the one that is left has become more and more attached to my daughter and me, showing herself very affectionate and responsive and continuously 'talking' and communicating with all sorts of meowing tones: stretched and short, beckoning and reproachful, asking for food and attention etc. She has started peeing into a huge bonsai plant pot resulting in the bonsai throwing off lots of leaves! We've had to cover the soil with some dried palm leaves that keep her off. Her litterbox is kept meticulously clean, so that can't be the reason for her doing that. We are keeping a spot on the balcony with fresh soil and some grass for her to occupy which overlooks the garden area and trees with the birds - which she can get excited about - and she seems to feel quite comfortable there. She has a meter-long tree trunk/stump to scratch there too. Recently with my daughter going to the hospital more often and me working longer hours frequently and at rather irregular times she has become more nervous and has started to pee on our things. Today she did so on my bed! It seems she's quite anxious about a possible fundamental change in our lives, similar to a move or loss of a companion. So, maybe this feliway spray would actually provide some comfort for her too! Thanks for mentioning here again Anna - I remember that you've mentioned it on a chat, also (!) --- cool!



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Anna
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Re: cat education

Postby Anna » 14 Jun 2013, 06:53

Hi Barbara. Yes the Feliway spray was very cool - it is actually recommended especially in situations where things happen that changes the cats life and can be 'traumatizing' in one way or another.

From what I have seen, if the cat doesn't have any health or mental problems, the reason for peeing/pooping outside the litter box, either has to do with personal preferences like Kelly mentioned or it has to do with the litter box itself. So it could be it's placement, it's size or the type of litter used that might be hurting the cat's paws.

There's a lot of litter out there that advertises for the human with pretty crystals and nice smell - but none of that takes the cat into consideration, how it has to smell stinky perfume every time it goes to the toilet or how it has to step on sharp crystals when it needs to pee.

Our litter box is a huge transparent Ikea box (the biggest one they had: 100 ltr). We've cut a hole the size of a cat in the middle (which wasn't easy because it's hard plastic) and filled it up with two boxes of litter. We use the normal clay kind that klumps after a lot of trial and error with other litter boxes and other litters. So after a long period of testing, we settled on the cat litter that the cats like the best. It's from the local supermarket and quite inexpensive. Unfortunately it is not great for the environment. This has to be developed still, a litter that works best for all. But our litter never ever smells so you don't need it to be covered in perfume.

So what one can do too, is to observe one's cat's daily patterns. Now obviously it can be that it simply enjoys the feel of 'going in nature' and if it's an indoor cat, there's not much you can do about that. Then you might have to discard the Bonsai because the cat can be attracted to it's own smell and then develop a habit of going there, and you can't very well clean a bonsai. But if putting the leaves there or something else that the cat won't be able to pull off, then problem solved cool - lol.



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KellyPosey
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Re: cat education

Postby KellyPosey » 14 Jun 2013, 08:25

The cat might also poo on the dirt because that is where it would make sense to poo so that microorganisms that live in the ground/soil can get to the poo to break it down. So from the cat's standpoint that may just seem to make the most sense and it feels naturally inclined to go there according to it's senses.

Things like this are definitely very interesting and cool opportunities to really observe every aspect to see if we can get to a point of understanding and learn about our physical reality and it's processes and the beings in it.



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barbara
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Re: cat education

Postby barbara » 14 Jun 2013, 11:28

Yes, it will need testing and watching - seems like she doesn't like clothes and stuff lying around and she's 'making' us clean up more, showing it with peeing on them and an unmade bed, because when we have the time to get our clothes stored away etc. we usually also have more leisure time for her. Maybe that's her way of showing us to slow down more ;)

Thanks!



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Anna
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Re: cat education

Postby Anna » 14 Jun 2013, 14:26

I don't think the cat pees on your clothes to make you clean up more. I definitely suggest also calling a vet if it continues because it can be a health issue.



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barbara
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Re: cat education

Postby barbara » 14 Jun 2013, 22:14

She started peeing where there were bags and suitcases on the floor which were only lying there when one of my daughters was about to leave again after visiting for some days. That was also around the time when her last companion died. Once or twice on other occasions. Then we moved to the city, which was quite a shock for her with all the commotion and the ride in the car and so much stuff lying around for quite a while. There were a lot of people coming and going for some days and some time after that she started peeing about once a week or so, on clothes piled up on chairs, my bed once and the bonsai, and onto a towel in the bathroom which had slipped from the tub to the floor. So I don't think this is something organic as the intervals are so irregular. I'll be watchful though. The vet is always an option of course. She is still more nervous than she used to be - maybe I should consider something homeopathic, like gelsemium. I'll have to google.




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