a question about self forgiveness

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Daniel Martinez
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a question about self forgiveness

Post by Daniel Martinez »

is self forgiveness about being willing to understand myself instead of judging myself? and in that, thus, that's how self forgiveness is self expansion as one opens up to see the bigger picture instead of stubbornly remaining close minded not allowing oneself to open oneself up enough to understand? ... but also, then, self forgiveness goes hand in hand with learning/investigating to understand. i mean, because, it's not like i'm going to forgive myself for experiencing hate for example and then all of a sudden understand how the system/construct/design of hate function and operate. because if that was the case then i would not have to ever do any research or investigation on anything because i can just forgive myself and automatically i will then know everything. i'm not sure if i'm making myself clear here. i would just like to really grasp and understand clearly without a doubt what self forgiveness really is and means.

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Leila
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Re: a question about self forgiveness

Post by Leila »

Yes, in Self Forgiveness you are clarifying and gaining greater understanding into a point. Whenever a point, pattern, energy, emotion, etc comes up -- it's to look at the 'message' behind it, what it is we are missing and need to re-align within ourselves. Then - there is no more need for the message and so it dissolves, you can surrender it and let it go. Unless you decide to not hear or heed to the message after you've properly 'read' it - which is where your self honesty, self will and self movement comes in -- to put into practical application

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Daniel Martinez
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Re: a question about self forgiveness

Post by Daniel Martinez »

Yes, in Self Forgiveness you are clarifying and gaining greater understanding into a point. Whenever a point, pattern, energy, emotion, etc comes up -- it's to look at the 'message' behind it, what it is we are missing and need to re-align within ourselves. Then - there is no more need for the message and so it dissolves, you can surrender it and let it go. Unless you decide to not hear or heed to the message after you've properly 'read' it - which is where your self honesty, self will and self movement comes in -- to put into practical application
i'm not clear on what you mean when you say "the message". how is it that then there is no more need for the message and then it dissolves? i don't understand? can you explain? it sounds interesting what youre saying and i'd like to know what you mean exactly.

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Kristina
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Re: a question about self forgiveness

Post by Kristina »

Hi Daniel,

What Leila means - and Leila, you can cross reference if this was the point you were mentioning, but to the reactions we have, there is an essence within it. LIke if we are reacting to our family because of this or that reason, there's actually something deeper going on in that reaction. it's not really because we don't like what our family is saying or doing, it's because somehow we are defining them or ourselves according to what we see in our family. LIke we could judge them a lot for who they are, but in that judgment we are actually judging ourselves. and so the message is where are you judging yourself? why are you judging yourself? take the focus off the family and look at who you are and what you are living... do you judge you?

Does that make sense?

The message in our reactions, memories, experiences, habits, behavior, thoughts, etc... is something for us to see/understand/forgive in ourselves. it's here to support us to realize and change. And then once you see why you are doing what you are doing or reacting the way you are reacting... once you find the lesson in the reaction for YOU to become aware of who YOU are, then the memory, reaction, pattern, behavior has served its purpose. now you see, now you understand it no longer is needed to come up within you because you've taken responsibility for it in seeing who you are within it and where you are out of alignment from what is best for all. so you forgive, commit to changing, and live that change in real time moments. it's like saying "message received!" lol

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Leila
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Re: a question about self forgiveness

Post by Leila »

Yes, exactly like that Kristina :)

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Daniel Martinez
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Re: a question about self forgiveness

Post by Daniel Martinez »

What if I don't understand why I am reacting? Not sure what to say, but for me it is not so easy. Sometimes I try to forgive myself for a reaction but then I'm like "why or how do I intend to forgive myself if I don't feel like I care right now?". Or many times I consider that in forgiving myself or apparently forgiving myself I am being passive like saying "I accept that I've allowed myself to.....". Yet sf means I am making the desicion to change? In some cases must I first investigate a point/reaction to understand it before I am able to actually forgive myself for allowing it? .... Well right now I am remembering that that's probably why I must write about the point first and then do the SF.
..... I have for months came up with theories about what SF means, in other words - what forgiveness means. Many times I have felt a feeling when I try to do SF, as I try to feel good or positive in relation to what I've allowed, and in that I say "I forgive myself".but I am almost completely certain that that's a mindfuck. Then I've tried meaning SF without feeling anything. Yet if I remember correctly a destonian some time ago told me that if I'm just writing SF without feeling anything then I'm just wasting my time. ... Some years ago another destonian told me SF is self acceptance. But in one of cerise's blogs I read some time ago that an interesting thing about self acceptance is that it has nothing to do with acceptance. I think I understood that self acceptance is not about accepting self as what self has allowed, but it rather has to do with accepting the truth of self.
Various times I have tried to find a reason for which I can accept to forgive myself. Meaning, for example sometimes I'll be trying to do SF on a reaction trying to grasp SF and like looking for a reason for why I deserve to forgive myself, and then I'll forgive myself because I see I am committing myself to walk a long-term process and I'll see that I have actually made many efforts in this, and so I'll see that as a valid reason to accept my SF.
And so, for me grasping and understanding what SF is and means has been confusing.

joe kou
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Re: a question about self forgiveness

Post by joe kou »

What i suggest is to soften your focus for a moment - because it can be really easy to get stuck on trying to know exactly what SF should be - and in that you end up missing the realization that SF is something that is unique to each individual, and each individual will have to discover for themselves when SF clicks and when it doesn't.

For me i find it more useful to see what transformation happens after doing SF. to me it is not so much about a feeling or some sensation that indicates i "did it correctly". for me it is whether or not - as i am writing and/or speaking the SF, i am really taking a moment to re-establish the 'who i am' in regards to whatever it is am doing SF on. and at the end of it - i might not feel positive, or happy or feel that anything special has happened, but i will have more a sense of clarity, of presence, and having a sense of direction. whereas before, i would perhaps be stuck repeating a scene in my mind, or stuck on a particular series of emotional reactions, or stuck in a mode of 'analyzing' a problem in my head.

Sometimes you do not need to understand the source of what your reaction is - sometimes you just need to establish the fact of "okay whatever reaction it is, it is still ultimately just a reaction. and i can always choose to not participate in a reaction." And maybe just by dropping that energy and dropping that reaction unconditionally you then realize where it came from.

SF is indeed a very personal journey - and like diets and exercise regimens everyone will be able to share what worked for them and how they do it - but ultimately it is something you develop over time. for now i'd suggest easing off a bit on trying to figure out what it means and don't worry about getting it wrong or 'wasting time'. Instead look more at what results you are getting, why you are applying SF in the first place, and getting the 'feel' for what shifts inside you when you practice the SF and use that as your guide.

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Kristina
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Re: a question about self forgiveness

Post by Kristina »

Hey Daniel,

I agree with Joe - you are overthinking 'what' self-forgiveness and 'how' you're supposed to be doing it. It really is a personal relationship you develop with self-forgiveness through using it. So can speak it or write it down... don't go looking for something to forgive, just look within yourself at that moment as see where you had a moment in the day that you see you could be different in. Was it resistance to going to work? Was it getting angry at a family member? Was it feeling fear of losing something? Start small, but start the practice of forgiveness because it definitely can open you up to a much greater understanding of firstly you, and secondly everyone else and everything else.

I used to write out my self-forgiveness on the computer, and then once I was done, I would go back and read what I wrote out loud, and using my voice to speak assertiveness and stability as I would speak the SF... this was a point for me to 'mean' what I was saying. I embodied and expressed a voice that meant what I was saying, I was here as I was saying it, and I pushed myself to trust that what I was saying was supporting. So can play around with different things... find where self-forgiveness works best for you. I've also spoken it out loud in the car or writing with a pen and piece of paper. You have to find what works for you.

If there is a resistance to forgiveness, start with that. Because resistance indicates a limitation we are imposing on ourselves. So can take what others say and practice it for yourself and see what you find, but be open to finding your own solutions, using the tools you have of self-responsibility, self-honesty and common sense. And if you can't find why you're angry at something and you don't know what to forgive, forgive just the anger initially. or forgive thoughts you have about someone else. make it a point to practice daily so that you are strengthening this habit of forgiveness, which creates a fine-tuning of your self-introspective abilities.

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