Luka's Writings

Marlen
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Re: Luka's Writings

Postby Marlen » 12 Mar 2012, 18:00

I suppose it has to do with me in the beginning speaking about desteni to her from the starting point of wanting to share information, knowledge, but i was not even living it yet.
So that also created consequences
[...]
i mean probably she was showing to me that i was only focusing myself on breathe all the time, but wanting to suppress some things, because i didn't started directly through writing. I also started sharing and sharing and wanting others to see this, and she saw that, yet with her reaction it was very difficult to speak.
Hey Laura - cool. I suggest to take these points to your thread wherein we will be walking with them to start off with in terms of what you have written/ opened up for yourself recently. You can take the entire writing if you see it is pertinent and walk through with the necessary Self Forgiveness.

As you can see the point of not directing yourself through writing then creates a layer of knowledge and ideas of process instead of actually doing so, which is how most of the people can create several ideas and judgments about what we do without them giving themselves the opportunity to walk-it themselves. So, we stop projecting any knowledge and information and instead live it- become it. It's way more simple to share it as an actual integrated aspect of yourself other than trying to prove someone 'that you have changed' or anything like that, in the end the point is about you-yourself supporting you. Any reactions or considerations of people seeing such 'change' are irrelevant, as you are doing this for you within the understanding of the greater context that this process is for.

For all practical reasons, walking the information as an actual living-process is what is suggested - any judgment that comes from a fence-sitting point is then only a knowledge and information based judgment = irrelevant in all cases.

Thanks for sharing.



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Luka
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Re: Luka's Writings

Postby Luka » 18 Mar 2012, 13:04

Desteni presentation experience (On Blog)

Last Tuesday I had a presentation on the Creativity Hour in psychiatric hospital, where I stay during the week. The presentation was about Desteni and my personal Desteni experience. I had this 10 minute presentation and I was talking about Desteni group in general, about Desteni I Process Course and about Equal Money System. Then we had a 10 minute discussion about the presentation, where some patients/listeners were pretty much interested and were asking me questions and there was two who desparately wanted to oppose me (I have no idea why such emotional reaction). Someone didn't like the pyramid system of payments and claimed that it's all about the money and about Equal Money System that is a complete Utopia. I defended myself quite good, opposing the misunderstandings with facts and I think that the general impression was good. I also had this booklets which Blaž provided me, and I gave them to the listeners. I only had 5 booklets and the listeners there were like 20, so I would need some extra ones so that everybody would get one. I would like to mention that the nurse who was listening my presentation too also got interested and got herself one of these 5 booklets. Some woman patient also showed some extra interest and asked me for my handy phone so that she will call me when she will be released from the hospital. I had guiding points written on the paper and I was talking freely. During the presentation I had no extra feelings/emotions, I only had this fear before the presentation that I will be unable to answer questions, because I am relatively new to the community. I admit that I took some extra medication (Lorazepam) for some support, because the presentation was quite exhausting to me and I think that I wouldn't made it without it and I also had to listen to two more presentations.



Marlen
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Re: Luka's Writings

Postby Marlen » 19 Mar 2012, 16:52

Hi Luka

Cool that you shared about Desteni and Equal Money with more people and that you were able to walk through the doubts that emerged.
One point to clarify is how when presenting Desteni or Equal Money, we suggest to focus on sharing our own experience and walk through it, wherein we focus on presenting the tools of Self Support such as Writing, applying Self-Forgiveness, Self Honesty, Breathing and the participation that we have in this forum. The same with Equal Money wherein we explain the principle of Equality as a the way to correct the current problems and crisis that we're living in various aspects in the world.

With regards to the 'pyramid system of payments' that could have been misunderstood as a 'pyramid scheme' which is linked to 'making profit' only and a pyramid structure which is how DIP works in relation to having groups of people as the core-group from which others are supported through the buddy system and those support others at the same time. So I would see it more not as a 'pyramid structure' but as a circle that that goes expanding as people join in - just like when a drop falls on water and first there's only one small circular wave and it expands outwards, that's how I see as it expands horizontally as there are no 'hierarchies' per se, but only people with more experience within the process that stand as that initial point that generates the following waves.

Alright - cool and it would be cool that as you go along walking your process here, if you have any other opportunity to share with more people, you do so from your own experience as this is how we have realized it is the most effective way, to share how you have supported yourself within applying the tools, points that you go realizing or have noticed about yourself.

And, whenever you have any doubts on how to share, let us know and we can assist with giving further perspectives as well.

Thanks for sharing



Maya
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Re: Luka's Writings

Postby Maya » 19 Mar 2012, 18:53

Yes, I agree with Marlen.
cool that you stood up and shared yourself in your presentation as well as here on the Forum.



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Lindsay
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Re: Luka's Writings

Postby Lindsay » 20 Mar 2012, 10:14

Cool support Marlen -

Some considerations to add/expand on, specifically in relation to the response Kim provided on your actual blog-post, Luka:
Hey Luka,

it seems like you believe that somehow you need to defend or prove Desteni to other people, which is why you placed yourself in a situation of experiencing fear with regards to not being able to answer questions, thus feeling as though you need to take more medication to be able to handle the situation. I would suggest though to investigate your starting point in wanting to defend yourself as 'part of the Desteni community' or thinking that you need to convince others of what you are doing (process of self-realization), as this process is actually about you discovering who you are - and by focusing on other people and what they think, you're only creating this experience of fear within yourself and thus making things more difficult on yourself. Just a point to consider.

Cheers, Kim

Within this, suggest to take a look at the entire play-out of the presentation, because, like you noted: you are 'new' to this process, and as such it's to be careful to not 'present Desteni' but to instead present yourself, as what you have seen/realized within the walking of your process - how you have supported you with the tools that Desteni offers - so as to ensure you're not just presenting knowledge and information, which indeed has the tendency to create reactions from others who will then challenge this - I mean, reactions will come from others regardless, but it's 'who we are' within it all that's to be investigated and sorted out to ensure that when we speak to others we're stable, directive, here, breathing, and voicing ourselves from a stance of living words as common sense. Because, we're not here to 'defend' anything, as this process doesn't need defending, thus if you see that you experienced yourself as needing to defend something, to sort this out for yourself in writing, self-forgiveness, and self-corrective application to come to a point of clarity for yourself.

Also suggest to take a look at within writing, the accumulation of coming to the decision to take more medicine than required so as to be able to 'present' - you stated that you took extra meds 'for some support' - however, suggest to take a self-honest look in regards to: was this really 'support' in fact? I understand that at the moment this medication is assisting you, yet taking more than necessary so as to not have to face the actual fear existent in you and work through it practically, can actually create further consequences - which is why it is suggest to first walk self, get self stable, before 'going out into the world' and sharing Desteni.

This presentation was actually a cool feedback for you in showing you what it is you require to work with - yourself - to first focus on self-communication before communicating with others about Desteni/DIP/Equal Money, so that when you do come to this point again, you are speaking you as what you have actually lived, in fact, which you will not require anything extra to relay, such as extra meds - but simply yourself here, sharing unconditionally from what you have lived.

So yes - continue sharing here and walking your process, step by step - becoming a living example of self-change.

Thanks for sharing Luka



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Cathy
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Re: Luka's Writings

Postby Cathy » 20 Mar 2012, 16:42

I agree with the cool support given here. And, it's cool Luka that you decided to share. However, it's important that you not push yourself to a point of requiring extra meds.

When I first began walking the Desteni process just over 4 years ago - I was regularly taking the prescription diazepam, which is a benzodiazepine, the same as Lorazepam, and so I would suggest to never take more than is prescribed.



Marlen wrote: One point to clarify is how when presenting Desteni or Equal Money, we suggest to focus on sharing our own experience and walk through it, wherein we focus on presenting the tools of Self Support such as Writing, applying Self-Forgiveness, Self Honesty, Breathing and the participation that we have in this forum. The same with Equal Money wherein we explain the principle of Equality as a the way to correct the current problems and crisis that we're living in various aspects in the world.
What Marlen wrote is important - and will assist you so that you won't be tempted to take extra meds.

Through the process of self-forgiveness, I was able to walk myself off of all medications,(and I was taking over 9 different ones), however, I was also under the supervision of my Doctor while I was walking off of them. So continue to breathe and share here Luka and you'll know when you're ready to push through points without having to add extra meds.



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Luka
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Re: Luka's Writings

Postby Luka » 26 Mar 2012, 08:15

Thanks to everybody for the support.

I forgive myself that I've mentioned that irrelevant fact that I have taken additional medication for my presentation.
I forgive myself that I am ashamed by the fact that I have taken additional medication for my presentation.



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Lindsay
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Re: Luka's Writings

Postby Lindsay » 26 Mar 2012, 10:49

Thanks to everybody for the support.

I forgive myself that I've mentioned that irrelevant fact that I have taken additional medication for my presentation.
I forgive myself that I am ashamed by the fact that I have taken additional medication for my presentation.
Luka - do you see these self-forgiveness statements as self-honest?

Why are you forgiving yourself for mentioning that you took extra medication?

Is that self-forgiveness statement self-directed within you seeing the point and taking self-responsibility to correct it?

Because, it is actually not irrelevant, at all, but indeed quite relevant, as it is providing you with an opportunity to face yourself, to bring that moment here and investigate for yourself what accumulated within you to the make the decision to take more medication. What was the backchat that you participated in? What were the justifications?

Dig deeper!

Why do you see it is as 'irrelevant'?

What are you specifically ashamed of?

What is the self-judgment?

It is through daring to look at all aspects of a point/ourselves, that we can get down to the nitty gritty details and correct ourselves from the root - not just glaze over what's actually going on so we can continue deceiving ourselves and remaining complacent in a 'comfort zone' that isn't actually even comfortable when seen for what it is - it's just us becoming comfortable with our own discomfort.

So, suggest to really apply yourself in this specific point/event, as there are many dimensions to peel back that have the potential of being very cool support for you, and we're here to provide feedback and perspective - so please share.



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Anna
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Re: Luka's Writings

Postby Anna » 26 Mar 2012, 12:32

Very cool support here Lindsay.



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Luka
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Re: Luka's Writings

Postby Luka » 27 Mar 2012, 08:09

Well, I think that it is all connected to my current mental condition and myself being ashamed of that. I have a problem writing a blog because of that shame, stating my inabilities. I am also depressed/afraid what would people think about me when reading my blog. On the other hand I think that writing a blog is a big step forward, like sharing things, because I remember like one year ago I wrote my inabilities and current mental condition to my friend Blaž and being so ashamed of it that I locked it with a password, so that no one else could see it.




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